Table of Contents
- Introduction
- INTJ Overview
- > Conversing with an INTJ <
- Frequently Asked Questions
- Credits
Conversing with an INTJ
Do’s and Don’ts (mostly Don’t’s):
DON’T ask one of us a question unless you really want a truthful answer. We will not sugarcoat it for you, and we don’t tell white lies to spare anyone’s feelings. Do you really, truthfully want to know if those jeans make your ass look fat? Normal person’s response: “Um, no, you look fine. Really.” Honest person’s response: “Well… maybe a different belt would help?” INTJ’s response: “No, it’s not the jeans that make your ass look fat; it’s your fat ass that makes your ass look fat.”
DON’T express an opinion to us unless you are prepared to back it up with sound arguments and well pedigreed facts and evidence. Otherwise do not be surprised when we logically shred your opinion for you and hand it back to you in tatters.
DON’T be repetitive. We have absolutely no patience for that. There’s no need to cover old ground, and we heard you the first time, unless we were zoning out. And if we were zoning out it’s probably because you started repeating yourself.
DON’T take 100 words to say what could have been said in 10. Content-free speech will cause an INTJ to zone out faster than repeating yourself.
DON’T engage us in “small talk”. Keep in mind that you are competing for our attention with all the voices in our heads, and they are bound to be far more interesting than you. The voices are constantly regaling us with things like anagrams of Wayne Newton (Wanton Weeny, We Annoy Newt, New Yawn Tone, …) and candidate titles for parodies of “Carry On My Wayward Son” (“Cary Grant Was Six Foot One”, “Curry On My Egg Foo Yung”, …). Do you really think your talk of the weather or your six year old’s soccer league is going to be more compelling than that? Please. Be realistic.
DON’T look at an INTJ in bewilderment when he/she discloses an idea to you. Yes, it may have required a double somersault of imagination to reach their conclusion. Ask them to take you through it step-by-step; they will happily oblige. Ideas are of ultimate importance to an INTJ, and it is a compliment for them to share their ideas with you. Similarly, failing to give due attention to an INTJ’s idea is a high form of insult.
DO… um… well, we thought there should be at least one “DO” but we can’t think of one. Oh, how about this: DO keep it short.
{ 139 comments… read them below or add one }
I know this is not relevant in dealing with INTJ’s, but do you personally believe that individuals have a moral obligation to help those in it? Please explain your stance.
Not necessarily, but it would depend on the situation.
ENFJ? SO Close! Some of the same qteiulas though for sure. Like this one: “ENFPs have what some call a “silly switch.” They can be intellectual, serious, all business for a while, but whenever they get the chance, they flip that switch and become CAPTAIN WILDCHILD. Sometimes they may even appear intoxicated when the “switch” is flipped.” This should be called the “Caleb Switch”.
dear brooke,
i read the chain and felt that you have not really got an answer to your question. i am an intj and let me tell you my personal answer. i think your question is , ‘do intj believe that they have a moral obligation to help intjs around them?
my answer is ‘no’. reasoning:
1. helping others belongs to the category- ‘that would be nice’, but i would not categorize it as a moral obligation.
some of my moral obligations are-
1. paying your debts (financial and otherwise)
2. devoting your life to ones whom you commit to
3. integrity
…. and more
and this ‘answer’ applies to all people. i would not behave differently based on other person’s personality type.
but everyone is different and i am sure within the ‘same personality type’, there would be different personal answers.
SG
In what?
Alright listen Brooke, you posted this arbitrary, irrelevant (and structurally unsound) question on a site entitled “The Complete Idiot’s Guide to the INTJ”. These pages hold a document that was created specifically for COMPLETE idiots – did you not read ANY of it?
Excuse me, yellow devil, you neglected to add a comma between the words “listen” and “Brooke”.
…You spelled ‘Yellow’ wrong. I didn’t think that was humanly possible for anyone without a mental impediment. What ARE they teaching children in schools these days?
How do you know they spelled it wrong? It is after all nothing but a user name.
I’m INTJ but not regularly what one could perceive as the described harsh INTJ. OK, probably in my mind. Nature vs nurture: Mom always taught me if I didn’t have something nice to say, then don’t say anything. So although I’d THINK something was irrelevant or plain ol’ dumb-ass, etc., I may (note the “may”, not WILL) keep it to myself, while biting my tongue. At least sometimes. BTW, the guide is “compleat” – the archaic spelling (not “complete”).
Yes, in fact, I actually did read the document. I simply do not care how idiotic I appear to be. I posted the question, because I am aware of the possible thought provoking ideas that I could stumble across when asking an INTJ. Forgive me for acknowledging that many of you have enlightening opinions. Now, if any INTJ could look past my stupidity (as difficult as it may seem) and have an intellectual conversation concerning moral obligations in society, my email is brooke.robinson55@yahoo.com. Thank you for the time and proving how intellectual some of you actually are!
@Brooke,
Now, that’s how to talk to INTJs! Much better. I think INTJs are somewhat prone to taking highly moral stances because we typically like the world to behave according to logical rules. However we are smart enough to know that the world is somewhat arbitrary. We abhore injustice and arbitrary decisions. However, our introverted nature usually prevents us from joining groups that share our concerns. We are not joiners. We prefer to contribute behind the scenes.
Thank you, Mike.
Let’s just say I am not as different as many think I am. ;P This is my debate topic for next month, so I am attempting to listen to as many diverse opinions as possible. From what I have heard so far, the opinions are very consistent and logic. We as human beings are only as strong as our weakest link. Therefore, we are require to help others for progression. Now, I am searching for an logical opposing view on the topic, but all I can come across is that it eliminates altruism.
You’re a smart girl, Brooke.
My guess is you are an INTJ, Brooke. Brilliant of you to exercise your right to sound like an idiot when posting a question regarding an “Idiot’s Guide,” particularly if you were trying to conceal your INTJ nature for the purpose of scientific observation.
@Brooke:
Being an existentialist/nihilist (labels I allow myself to be classified under only to save time on explanations), I don’t believe in any sort of inherent meaning or moral rules. That being said, I agree with Mike on the need for justice; the difference is that it’s an internal, personal conviction sort of justice rather than the kind derived from any dogma or law. As a general rule for INTJs I believe our maxim (in the form of a question) applies here as well: “Does it work/make sense?”
I agree with Mercury’s maxim; however, I would like to take it one step further. I think the INTJ, due to his/her strict adherence to logic as well as perfection, not only asks, “Does it work/make sense?” but must also ask, “Does it work the best/make the most sense?” INTJs have the unique ability to understand idealism while maintaining the presence of mind to apply reality. True, strong INTJs don’t take moral directives from pieces of paper, but rather from logic. Ultimately, that logic will lead us to, “What is the best POSSIBLE outcome for all, given what is currently achievable.” At all times, do the least possible harm (not necessarily because we particularly care for all of the other types or even the INTJs, but because if this code is followed, the least possible harm is done to us). This is a tough concept because it doesn’t necessarily have to take into account time. In short, we only help out when it becomes apparent that no one else can do it and only for self preservation. Some INTJs may feel this is heartless; however, they probably share traits with other types. A very, very….very small number of any personality types are 100% that type, especially INTJ more than all others.
I just found out that I am an INTJ. Don’t you think this is a bit short for someone else to get? Sometimes I feel like we have to explain it a bit further for people, or maybe that’s just us? All in all though, this explains us quite well.
Given there are so few of us INTJ’s, I’m curious what the profession breakout looks like. I’m an INTJ, PhD in Stats & Research. My buddy, also an INTJ, is an outstanding Systems Architect & Engineer. Do you have statistics on the rest of our small population?
Hi John. This is from the database of INTJ Forum member profiles in 2009 when we tried to find out the most common occupations.
# Occupation Members
01. Engineer 128
02. Manager 87
03. IT 78
04. Consultant 60
05. Analyst 57
06. Writer 54
07. Teacher 46
08. Designer 44
09. Programmer 44
I also belong to INTJ club, as of tomorrow I will complete a 20 year career as a Police Officer and go into retirement. So please count 1 for Police as a career.
Juan, count that as two. I teach criminal justice and homeland security classes at the college level now, but I had a 10 year career in law enforcement. To that end, I’ve met at least three other INTJ’s just on my last department alone. By the way, congrats on the retirement brother.
You might be surprised at the number of military pilots that are INTJ. Not all of us are the extroverts Top Gun made us out to be.
How many intj clergy are there? I am an INTJ bishop in an Anglican denomination and was wondering if the Church was more than just ENFJs, ENTPs and INFJs.
well, I’m an INTJ Anglican priest, so there’s at least one.
Have to ask: how did you reconcile faith vs. your assertion that you’re an INTJ?
John, that is a long story. Let me just say that I don’t believe that some things, especially fragile and complex systems, are the result of happenstance.
I’m a paralegal, and quite content not to be a lawyer, thank you very much.
I love the problem solving aspect; what I refer to as the “treasure hunt”. My motto? As Detective Joe Friday says: Just the facts, ma’am.
Me INTJ. Me big head. Think big thoughts. INTJs actually grow a sense of humor when they get slap happy…or so I would like to believe.
Seriously though, I really am an INTJ. Career? I started off working in the environmental impact section of an entomology lab. Not long afterwards, I met my spouse when we were oh-so-young-and-good-looking Marine Biologists for the federal government. He is an INTJ as well.
I went on to work as an environmental scientist and botanist for the state park service. We both got fed up with the ridiculous games you have to play to work for “the man”…so we started our own environmental consulting business doing wetland delineations, section 106′s and phase I / phase II ecological site assessments.
Variety is sweet, yet my passion and first love will always be Marine Biology.
I am now in my mid 40′s and ‘retired’ due to health issues. I decided to take the advice of the INTJ information print out I received when I was given the test in college. I have mellowed out significantly (I am not the grammar Nazi I used to be and even make a ton of errors myself now — w00t!!) and have spent the last 5 years developing my personal relationships. Additionally, I no longer take myself or life as seriously because I have learned that to do so is completely illogical. I have fun now.
I am still, however, very introverted (I was 99.8% introverted on the test). So when I say I am working on my relationships, this means with my spouse, children and grandchildren.
Best wishes to all of my fellow INTJs et. al. ! =)
I thought I was alone in the world, sometimes I wonder how the other people even live in such a world being as stupid as they are It’s like they are waiting to die. NB I have my own DNA solutions company, and I left school at 16. I stopped paying attention when l was about 9 and they tried to teach me about all that GOD bullcrap. I had such objections too in english class about my interpretations of books and plays like all I asked was who the hell made some dope the last word on any subject he didn’t write the fecking thing. Not the sharing kind but I know you people get me. Also I said 25 years ago to my teacher he must be insane if he thought nothing can travel faster than light, he put me out of his class for a week, thanks cern where were you when I needed you.
Chris that sounds so familiar to me, I have always question not only people but the interpretation of things that other people don’t see. But you have to take a deep breath and smile a lot, otherwise is a lonely life.
This is a really funny thread.
I too thought to be alone in this world until I came across this forum. It explains a lot of what I went through growing up. I am glad there is at least a place to let out some of my sense of humor. I also came to realize recently that the reason why we are so demanding in other mere mortals is because we innocently think they are very similar to us. Without realizing it, we put people through a lot of unnecessary pressure, and that is why we are mostly lonely. I learned that we can’t expect our soul mates/ and or significant other to satisfy all of our emotional and intellectual needs. More often than not, it will be one or the other. It is hard to keep up with us and we don’t even do it on purpose… well, not all the time
I have a few Do’s for the Dos and don’ts.
Do: be honest with us if you don’t want to be ripped emotionally apart
Be sweet spontaneously from time to time.
Do watch your intentions around us, we can smell fear, dishonesty and betrayal.
Please do engage in interesting conversations if you want to stay in our “A” list of priorities.
And please Do try to love us although you may not understand why we like you
To INTJ Female, I recently found out that I’m an INTJ. Now for some odd reason I didn’t like it. But I would like to thank you. You gave me clarity.
Now it all makes sense. I happen to be the black sheep of the family so hard to get a explanation for my personality other than “there just something off with me” or “I just need to get out more…” Thanks helped a lot.
Glad to know someone’s happy. (No, I actually mean it this time.) I gave up on actual friends once it became abundantly clear voicing how I thought or felt only brought me a ridiculously high amount of awkward silences and odd looks.
Now I just let them see what they want to see so badly- a happy, light-oriented antisocial n3rd. I don’t care what they think, true, but I’m still a person. The last time I talked to someone- really talked to them, not meaningless rambling on the weather or during classes- was so long ago I can’t remember. Glad to have those voices for company, though I might be going more than slightly insane.
You don’t have to be friendless. You just need a special breed of friend. Seek out intelligent, logical, easy-going folks with similar interests. People who don’t get offended easily, love debate and abstract conversations. People who make you think, challenge your assumptions with strong arguments and find the same twisted things funny. It might take some time and effort but it’s so worth it.
Oooh! You qetoud me!Dude, look, you’ve definitely convinced me that you’re convinced. And I’m also completely convinced of your sincerity, and I tend to give the benefit of the doubt to sincerity.But about the Republicans, I don’t see how handing them an electoral defeat will convince them to shimmy back over to limited government. The last forty years has been about both parties moving toward the middle, but when it comes to the size of government, it’s the Republicans that have done all the moving, and it’s all been in the exact opposite direction that we want it to go. Bush and the current Congressional delegation are exhibits A and B.And the Democrats have a really big problem: for the most part, they simply aren’t capitalists. They cling ferociously to the belief that government power is the end all be all. They’ve long since found they’re magic hammer, and we’re they’re nails. When the Republicans lurch leftward on social spending, the Dems reflexively double-down. What we wind up with in the end is a one-way ratchet effect from both major parties towards Kudzu-like goverment.And don’t try too hard to convince me. I live in Austin, the Santa Monica of TX, and my Congressman is the incumbent Lloyd Doggett, Democrat. He’s a big unreformed leftie, and he’s going to win big, again, with probably 60% of the vote, so getting me to vote for him won’t add much to your mission.But hey, rock on with your bad self. I could be completely wrong.yours/peter
I wanted to comment to Brooke. We do care deeply for The people and The causes that we hold dear to our hearts. Committing to consistent outside devotion actually drains us. We have to go back within and regroup and recharge. I have done a great deal of charity work or selfless service from my heart but it has and will kick me hard if I don’t respect my need for very small doses. We believe in being Authentic. When we do give it is very real. Someone else mentioned that we prefer to do it behind the scenes and this is true because its easier on our psyche and hearts. Time is needed for everything to move through our intuitive side and rearrange the experience to our own internal systems. When its time to close it up and shut it down that’s it. Its Over! The respect and appreciation for our own inner process is needed.
@weeble I am the same type of INTJ. I think all the things in this article, but I generally keep them to myself unless I am tired, cranky, or a person has really ticked me off( INTJ thought: Where did that phrase “tick me off” come from? ).
@brooke Mike is right. Your second post generated all the responses you are getting because you are speaking our language there. I would agree with the other posts on the necessity to help people. We consider ourselves highly moral, but we don’t do well in groups or public all the time. I think we are more likely to donate money, then show up and help face to face regularly.
I wanted to comment on the need for an argument to have solid evidence. This need has deprived me of ever believing in Santa Clause or God( at least the one I had to learn about every Sunday in church ). At times, I envy other people’s capacity to believe.
Or not to rationalize LOVE, FEAR, etc but the worst one : not being able to enjoy cartoons when you are 7, knowing that the “coyote” can not stay up in the air,,,,,,, now at 48 I try to see the world thru my wife’s eyes, more simple and nicer way.
@Brooke: The problem with your question/query is that it is based on “morality” which is a mercurial concept at best. Whose morals? Who decides? To a bunch of INTJ’s you are essentially asserting some overarching authority (which we tend to reject) that demands something of all of us (INTJ et al.), yet there is no fundamental basis for that authority. Does helping the least of us strengthen the herd? Sure, but that’s just a bumper-sticker aphorism. “Does the help provided make sense?” and “will it work?” are better questions … at least to a INTJ.
To be sure, I comment as a committed, if deeply flawed, Catholic who believes in God and finds a great deal of worthwhile a great many religions. My morality is derived from study of my own and other religions. And I have a greatly difficult time understanding how one can assert a “moral responsibility” with resorting to them. I don’t mean to say that atheists are amoral, or that morality can’t possibly exist outside of religion. I just haven’t seen any basis for it other than Utilitarianism (which I reject out of hand because of its irredeemably flawed logical inconsistencies — e.g. greatest good for the greatest number of people).
My answer to your question, then, is that until you can assert a foundational moral concept which is defensible and universally adaptable, how can one possibly decide whether or not any one individual has a “moral” responsibility to another?
Well, since we INTJ’s do not tend to believe in anything unless proven by actual fact, I developed a rule. Anything that cannot be proven (religion in general, legends in general) I put in the “Folklore” cabinet and just keep hearing without listening. It saves brain capacity for the real important findings and insights we INTJ’s tend to have everyday.
I recently found out I’m INTJ, it all makes sense now. I’m not any sort of proffesional (yet) like I’m suppose to be, but I am a mastermind. It will all come together soon, I’m sure of it now. Well, back to work, if I dont do it then its not gona get done right or maybe not at all.
You don’t converse like an INTJ. Are you tired?
First, I just recently found out about being an INTJ through extensive research about myself and my actions. Then of course the testing. Do not get me wrong I enjoy being considered intelligent, but when we as INTJ’s make up such a small portion of the U.S it’s like we were born black sheep. I know everyone in my family just thinks I am “weird”. I consistently ask myself is this truly an advantage? Against my very nature of being an INTJ I do contemplate how people perceive me. Then true to my nature I weigh the advantages and risks of it. For example, Will I be turned down a job because I am not as friendly as the average person? The answer is usually “Yes”. As an INTJ I don’t flaunt my intelligence there’s no need. Why make yourself stand out more? It just makes you an easier target.
Also, we know our only chances of survival as a human race is that what been since the dawn of time. Naturally, we are social beings and we know the world would not be what it is now without communication. So, why do we go against our very carnal desire as a human to not communicate as effectively as others? Do we somehow psychologically distance ourselves from the world as kids subconsciously?
@Brooke When I was 10 in our class we had a debate. The debate was about should humans help one another to make this world a better place? Of course, 99% of the class said, “Yes”. Maybe because they are more social and feel the need to fit in? I took another stance and I said no my feelings about it were 50/50 and I didn’t care either way really. My teacher then told us to all make a poster as to why we feel the way we do and present it. Since I was the only one who went against the class she assigned me 3 kids who were outcasts as well to help me. I told them just to sit there and do nothing this is my project. The teacher asked all the kids who supported people helping people how they would help people? Alot of them said help the handicapped and build more ramps. At this time I kinda chuckled as ruthless as it may seem at 10. I thought how would more ramps really help the handicapped in the grand scheme of things? One kid even said, “make electric ramps” I chuckled even more at the thought of making the handicapped lazier. What was funny was they all were like YEAH, GOOD IDEA! AWESOME. (Funny to me anyways)
I then presented my project and argued no people shouldn’t have an obligation to help others in this world we are all born equal with equal weaknesses, strengths, and advantages. I then said what at the time the teacher looked at me in shock and awe I said, “Lets feed on the weak so we can divine in the nature of strength.”
If we are to progress as a world why should we help out others below our level? A common argument is to catch the people below you up to your level. Then I argue all that time catching them up has now slowed down progress into something great. Meanwhile, the people catching up are average.
Hahahaha, thank you, I wish I had been in your class. I do find that funny, actually. Similar instances have happened in my elementary days (but not as hilarious and profound as yours, admittedly).
Once when had to color little elephants and donkeys, chose a party which suit us best. It was an unspoken request—my teacher and myself, at the very least—that we were to discuss our standing with our parents because my teacher let us ‘think it over’ at home. Needless to say, I was insulted. Not only by the insinuation that I couldn’t have my own opinion, even if I was only nine years old, but because she was asking us to choose definitely which stance we were for and from only two parties. I told my teacher that day that I didn’t like either choice completely, and she just stared at me before telling me to make two different pictures. When everyone came back with all their elephants, I completely stood out with my elephant and donkey (I had been tempted to make a Donkphant or whatever it’s called because making two animals seemed like such a pointless waste of time, but that would was technically incorrect and didn’t even represent the Independent party, it represents Repubicrats… it’s strange that I was concerned with these things as a nine year old, and I am sure that I was because it’s such a vivid memory, but… INTJ thing, I suppose. It’s a recent discovery of mine also, you see. I just found out yesterday. But I’ve known that I’m introverted for a long time), and I was really annoyed that no one had a donkey. So when we all had to go up and say why we chose a party, everyone said something like, ‘my parents told me…’ but I said I made both animals to represent my neutral stance on the current issues, that you couldn’t solve any problems with only one viewpoint because not everybody had the same needs as others (And I completely agree with you—How could slowing down to allow others to catch up possibly help our species as a whole? Why should it matter to an individual when everybody has their own needs that must be met? Helping others is great and noble, sure, but really…). My classmates didn’t really appreciate my perspective; my friends asked me why I didn’t just say what my parents were, but my teacher seemed happy. Confused, possibly, but I think she was happy. Can’t really remember that part, I mostly remember how elated I felt in front of that classroom, even if I was entirely reluctant to be up there in the first place. Might as well make a show of it if you’re going to be forced there anyway, right? I should try remembering that when I have to present a project on Monday… I’ll make my partner do it for me, I did all the work anyway—I don’t like people doing work for me either, I get obsessed with correcting every one of their mistakes. Needless to say, I’ve only had one consistent partner in two years, and it’s only because I intimidate her into letting me do the majority of it… Intimidate is a strong word. Convince? Sure, I’ve convinced her. Or maybe I’m still her partner because we get A’s every single time, even if I force her to stay up to ridiculously late hours to check over my work even though I know that I usually shoot down her suggestions… I’m sadist, just a bit. Or maybe a bit aggravated that I’m the only one who does anything. Contradicting myself there? No. Not in my mind, anyway. I go by some rules of mine, you see, and to ‘contradict’ myself, I have to thoroughly confuse myself, and since I’m not, I haven’t.
Again, I find myself writing an entirely too long comment early in the morning. I should stop doing this, every time I do I tend to want to either delete it or banned myself from the computer at nights and early mornings, but I know I’ll never go through with it… Anyway, good comment. I apologize for going a bit off topic there.
Ciao.
1) It is damn intimidating communicating with INTJs.
2) I am an ENFJ. My brother is an INTJ. This leads into my question of:
Is there a specific personality type that annoys INTJs the most?
(And from the experiences I have had with my brother, the first assumed answer would be “ENFJ” in a sarcastic tone.) Seriously though, is there a personality type that is the most annoying AND why?
EF has to be the one that gets me the most. Sorry ’bout that, but since you asked…and it is just my .02. (returning to smile and nod mode)
From the research I’ve done, ENFPs and INTJs are said to get along swimmingly. Personally, I’m an INTJ and the Bestie is an ENFP, so I can attest to the ease of communication between the two types. For me, ESFJs tend to baffle me (thus frustrating me, and I strongly dislike being frustrated), as they seem to have their own unique version of logic (and also talk a lot. A lot). Something to do with “feelings”, or something like that.
That said, there is no hard-and-fast rule. My sister is an ESFJ, and we tend to get along pretty well. At least as far as I can tell.
I think the Myers-Briggs is a vaulable tool for helping us understand why we are the way we are and what motivates the personality types. Even more important is how they work together. In the workplace it can be of great assistance when putting together a team for a project. It’s also good to revisit the test if you see significant change in yourself or co-workers. 15 years ago I was an ENTJ when I worked for a large corporation. Now I’m an entreprenuer and I tested out last year as an INFJ.
@Rodr: I know facts. I believe theories.
@Mikethe2nd: Your story actually made me laugh out loud. Had some similar experiences growing up … ok, and a couple of weeks ago … fine, yesterday.
Awesome, I am glad you enjoyed the story MikeW. Do you want to share one?
@ Eric There really isn’t a specific personality type that pisses me off truthfully. There is a vast majority of people that do. Let me explain. Nothing pisses off an INTJ more than repetitiveness.
Nothing pisses us off more than people who speak out loud about something they have no clue about. We enjoy tearing those people apart. We know it can be intimidating talking to us we kind of get a kick out of it. So it’s generally best not to talk to us about something you are unsure about. Unless you let us know ahead of time you are confused and need us to explain.
Also, keep the small talk to a minimum(or not at all) we don’t really care about how you dropped your phone in toilet water or stubbed your toe in the morning. I am consistently trying to find patterns in life and society I can put mathematical equations to so I can possibly predict future outcomes. Ask yourself if you did this as a habit how much time would you have to hear about someones dog getting shampooed? We are considered “masterminds” not cheerleaders!
We are very effective computers because all data we put in to calculate is accurate and consistently self checked for flaws through testing and analysis on our own.
Follow these 3 steps and you are well on your way to not annoying us.
Oh, yes! I concur. I have found that small talk often seems a shallow, waste of time. I am also infuriated with people who speak strongly on something without having researched it, or at least stating that it is their OPINION.
@Mike and Bill.
Let’s just say I know how to get responses. ;P I live in a small town, so I have not been in contact with other INTJs. I am not as different from you as you may think. I am still young, so I am learning how to deal with people like me. Thank you all for the responses that have been posted. I am in search for someone who can argue both sides. I believe that a moral obligation to assist others is actually genetic.
Hi Brooke, I thought you might find this article interesting: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/03/100329152516.htm
Thank you, Tiffany. It’s amazing how things work.
But there is a lot to think about when researching with evidence. Societial will overall reflects an obligation to assist others (religion and governments are manifestations of this), although some individuals do not agree. Obligations are adjusted to fit our individual priorities and values, but are we born with the idea that we should help people? @Mikethe2nd, your story supports this. When we are young, we believe others should be helped, and we adjust it as we mature. I am currently looking for cases of this obligation being passed genetically.
I can see where your psioenalrty would be an ENFJ. I’m an INFJ, which by the way accounts for only 1-3% of the population. Another INJF, you might know…Jemma.
Finding this website has been one of the best and worst things for me as an INTJ. I’m glad knowing that I am not alone in the world, but knowing there are other like me leads me to feel more justified in how I act and treat other people.
I remember one story from my youth that that I am hoping some of you guys can relate with me. Growing up my siblings and I had a rule that we were not allowed in each others rooms without permission from that person. When my younger brother kept coming into my room without my permission, I proceeded to “booby trap” my room by putting an open knife above my slightly ajar door. The theory was that if my brother obeyed the rules and didn’t come in, he would be safe. If he broke the rules, he would have a consequence which I very clearly explained to him as I showed him what I was doing. Needless to say I got in trouble, but was frustrated when my parents couldn’t offer any rational explanation of why what I did was wrong. After all, if he did what he was supposed to, nothing bad would happen to him. When I tell most people this story they look at me like I am totally crazy, but to this day I don’t see what the big deal is.
What if there was a fire in your house, and he went into your room to warn you, and the knife stabbed him? Think.
I actually couldn’t agree more with that logic, you’re not crazy….or…you’re not crazier than me
Every time we challenge rules presented to us, we automatically understand there will be some sort of consequence if we’re caught. I personally, hate when I need to disipline my children. My logic is this: Bark so loud that you will never have to bite. Make the consequences to challenging the rules known and severe in hope of never have to enforce it. I don’t want to punish you, I just want you to stay out of my room! A knife really helps put the “!” there
If he was in his room during a fire (or any other time) the knife wouldn’t be there. Think!
Oh, so I’m not alone in that either?
I wasn’t as extreme as you because I was sure that I would get in trouble if I went so drastic (no offense meant, I actually find that hilarious and a pretty reasonable idea. If your brother did get hurt because of that, it really was his fault. Fire…? Not to be rude, Prion, but fire is… well, fire. It’s not going to come for you like a robber/assassin/whomever would if you call attention to yourself by yelling, “THERE’S A FIRE! RUN!”). For me, I normally just pull a chair up to the door to block people from going in (tied a string around two of the legs, pulled it until it hit the door, then tucked the evidence back under), stack up books, papers, objects in a certain sequence so I would know if it had been knocked over. If the person found how I had set the trap, I then could tell if they had tried to set it back to normal, to look like they hadn’t gone in at all, which wouldn’t work since they couldn’t possibly know the order of my objects. Worked twice. It’s unlikely anyone has tried again, since I still do it, but add on more ideas to make sure I’m not just getting predictable.
I argue the other side that it isn’t genetics it’s experience.
We are born learning to depend on others and that is ingrained through experience.
That may have been unclear so what I am saying is..
We are born learning to depend on others for survival and that is ingrained through experience. We then learn through experience it’s necessary for survival to help others in need.
I also argue that all acts done are done for a reason and there is no real such thing as a selfless act.
Yes, that was another point I was researching. Ultimately, social Darwinism affects our views on what can be justified as moral.
I am an INTJ and my really big question is that i’ve read everywhere INTJ’s are extremely intelligent but thats the one thing that doesnt fit me, i mean does being intelligent means to be able to calculate mathematical problems in your head? because if thats so than im not intelligent in that way atleast
Have you ever heard of Howard Gardner’s theory of multiple intelligences?
Well I did the test a while ago, then other things happened in my life that were a higher priority so I forgot about it for a while. Then a few days ago I was talking to a psychologist who is himself an INTJ and he was delighted, saying how rare a female INTJ is. Typically (of course!) I wanted to look into that for myself and find out if it was true.
I love this guide, it made me laugh many times. At last someone can explain why I constantly look at people around me, then have to plan what to say to express myself in a way they’ll not find incomprehensible. I never think I am overly intelligent, I expect everyone to follow me easily and – well you know the rest
BTW Kinza, not everyone has the same intelligence – I’m rubbish at Maths (and don’t correct the spelling there people, it is no typo, I am English so live with it ;P) but then my partner who can easily model 3D chemical structures not only in his head but can demonstrate them in 3D with his hands and can explain the radiation patterns of aerials in similar manner can’t understand how to hang towels on a rack so they don’t fall off and has put washing powder tablets in the dishwasher.
Not everyone has to be working on the same solution you know
Plus, whilst Maths eludes me for the sake of Maths, I can usually fly with the same calculations if they are applied to something that interests me. Same with remembering things, if it interests me I have a sponge brain but I really can’t understand how apparent morons know SO VERY MUCH about football!
I am labeled as a “hard person” (concerning feelings) because one question was asked at a family reunion and I guess my answer was not a popular one, so now please let me ask you INTJs.
You have embarked in a 4 day journey (walking) in the desert and have enough food and water to reach your destination (no more and no less) on the second day you see a person dying of hanger and thirst……
What would you do?
Ok here goes my answer: I said I will keep walking and send help when I reach my destination, it was funny the way they all looked at me,,,,
My logic is: if I share we both die. If I share I will make my family suffer my loss and last I don’t want to be “idiot” of the story…. Does make sense to anyone else?
You are correct, there is absolutely no point for you to give the water to him if you would die from thirst yourself anyhow from it. It would actually be even more immoral to give the person water because you are giving him/her false hope for a chance of survival. If you would take the person with you, you would be slowed down and both die.
If you would give the person food and water for let’s say a day, you could search around for a possible water source or a way to capture water. However all of these are hypothetical, while noble, they end up with the death of 2 persons.
So in the purest sense of the question, taking everything accordingly, your answer is the answer that would be used in the desert when you barely have enough left to reach a safe haven, you do not have the option to take a higher moral viewpoint, survival goes first. Besides you do have the intention to help the person with help that is assured to come.
You can in a more idealistic approach give the person water and food for a day and move on without water and food in the last day. But that is if you are conditioned to the environment.
So all in all (if you want to skip the large block of text): Yes it seems to be immoral to do the decision BUT it is the only real decision you can make with that hypothetical question, it’s that simple.
Meh.
You realize that you don’t expire from dehydration in one day. It takes three, and one day of water deprivation is merely going to give you a headache in most cases. Albeit, if you are crazy enough to walk in a desert during the day then you probably deserve whatever fate you have coming to you.
Two days left? Give them one day’s supply of water, but only a little food(no need to waste the water for digestion, when there are other vital processes to attend to and you can survive for three weeks without food). Then you know that you’ll make it alive to your destination and they’ll be alive when you come back to find them. (this, of course, is assuming that you want to save them and they are ‘dying’ of thirst when you find them)
Because two days would most definitely kill the other person if they are as you say they are.
comple*A*t idiots guide to? spelling? perhaps?? lol…x
I get you guys, you’re all good. Mmmm perhaps I was being judgemental?
share the love that is ever-present dudes and duderinos…mwwuhhh hhha hha…….HA xx
It isn’t misspelled. Compleat is an archaic, and you can often find it in the titles of compendiums and guides today.
This is the reasoning of the person who selected the title:” series of books. Second, because the archaic “Compleat” seemed more snobbish and condescending than “Complete”, which struck me as humorously appropriate given the nature of the handbook.”
“I did it for two reasons. First, it’s a play on the whole “Complete Idiot’s Guide to
I suppose it seems snobbish to you, but obviously most are unaware that it’s archaic, so it comes off as unintelligent.
That is the point though of the title, it tries to direct the reader into a specific mindset for the complete FAQ, which is full with sharp humoristic points.
Those tests are fun to do! I think that ethier one of the types fit you. It’ll be fun to take the test in another 10 years and see where we stand. Are you comfortable with ESFP? Do you notice that shift in yourself?Matt just took the test and he went from a previous INFP to INFJ, the same type as me. So weird! Also, you’ve been on fire with your blog posting lately.
hope im not moderated out xx
Nah. I just manually approve all comments because this blog gets massive amount of spam. Sometimes they won’t get approved until the next day.
I am pertty comfortable with being ESFP, although I still feel pertty connected to the ENFP as well. I will have to pay attention to myself to see if there is much of a difference, because while I have grown and changed, I don\’t think I have noticed a big shift.It is fun keeping a \”running tally\” so to speak of what is going on, a way to reference events and recipes, and keep in touch with people!
I think using an archaic spelling it pretty fitting really.
@ Juan – makes sense. Like if you saw someone being mugged and you are not an armed to the teeth cyborg, it’s better to get out of sight and call the police than get involved and both of you get beaten up…
You forget the fact people will act quite differently/cowardly if they know they’re being observed. Fr a safe distance, shouting that you can see them & that you’re calling the police can make a very large difference in the outcome…
without having to lift a finger.
Just found out yesterday I’m an INTJ, it nailed me. What now?
Just accept that you are superior to the vast majority of human beings walking this earth…and, if you want to do the other 98% a favor, attempt to consider their feelings from time to time, as painful as it can be. In the long run, it will make things easier for you as well : )
LOL
Yeah, bro treat it like marriage. You can be right or be happy. But you can’t be both.
Now I know why I choose to be single…I can be right AND happy!
Hey, thank you for your cmemont on my blog! And for following It's funny that you are posting about the Myers-Briggs Test today… I took the test half a year ago and turned out ENTJ (just like my boyfriend, LOL). And yesterday I found old paperwork including the Myers-Briggs I did at 17 (13 years ago ^^). I had ENTP back then. I think both are a good fit, but ENTP is a bit closer to myself. But: Still a pretty okay retest-reliability
I’m an INTJ psychologist. And although I like the humor of these answers very much, I must say that INTJ’s do have feelings (not only expressed in front of a Star Trek movie) and they can enjoy speaking about relationships, as long as logic and objectivity are leading the way…
In the end, psychology is all about people and relationships. And if INTJ’s didn’t care about people and relationships at all this wonderful guide wouldn’t exist (even if it serves our selfish agenda too…).
Thanks for this! =)
+1 from me
I think most INTJs simply undervalue understanding emotions. I’m sure most could figure it out internally and “feel” normally if they wanted to. It’s just not a priority.
In that way I feel a bit out of place; the system I most enjoy picking apart as an INTJ/P is human interaction. Maybe a bit similar to your own situation! People are the ultimate “system” to study, because they’re almost too varied and random to ever completely understand. Every person is an endless puzzle. As a kid I was so out of synch that I only learned how to relate to people by careful study. It sounds creepy, but it worked. I can blend in, I can and will be polite, I can have emotional conversations that are both logical and empathetic.
On the other hand I find I have a lot of sadness and frustration I cannot vent. If I don’t get sufficient alone time after dealing with people all of my flaws come clawing out. Many of the INTJs here talk about not caring at all and ignoring people. I wish I could do that so simply, but it seems that now I’ve opened the door, I cannot shove it closed.
That’s my one problem with typing, actually. It pats us on the back for being who we are, helps us understand ourselves and how we interact with others, but it doesn’t really encourage much growth. Almost the opposite. “You are ___. Congratulations. Keep being ___!”
Okay, so I am an INTJ, but my I is not super strong. I would say a good range of working with people is anywhere between 25% and 75% of my time. Any more and I feel overwhelmed, less and I feel isolated. I am also not super smart. IQ around 125-130 means smarter than the average bear, but not a MENSA candidate. So…
I am thinking of switching occupations. I have been in Human Resources and really like the more analytical aspects of it, and also the training piece. I had a couple of jobs working with HRIS (HR Info Systems) and really enjoyed it, but the day to day work was too isolating for me. Maybe a teacher or professor? Thoughts from the group?
125-130 still places you in the Superiour range, depending on the testing method used of course.
Q: Would you rather talk about systems & knowledge or create them?
It seems that the majority of you are pleased to find that you’re INTJs because you’re focusing on the intellectual qualities. This page is more like WORKspeak or Robo-clucking than chatting. But, I’m nearly sixty and have been identified twice, more than ten years apart as an INTJ. Our personal affairs bring confusion, pain, isolation and hardwork to succeed. I would much rather have an easier path with relationships and be less rare. It’s all well and good to be sooo clever. It easy to be good at something that comes naturally. But, machines and books can’t hold you or soothe you or please you. At my age, I feel that it’s nearly impossible for me to truly love anyone. I can NEVER shut my over analytical brain off. Unfortunately, logic and love never seem to meet.
INTJ’s are on their own perspective a bit cold, but that surely doesn’t mean we are lost causes on emotions. The major problem INTJ’s have is the fact that they have to go to their external self from time to time. I’m relatively young (late 20′s) and had the same problem with being overanalytical, introvert and hence being shown as cold. HOWEVER, you’d be surprised how warm we actually are when listening and talking to our friends and just even people.
One wise phrase i can quote from my ENTJ flatmate “if you open up just a little to people, you’ll be surprised how open people will be to you”. And with our analytical prowess, a bit of psychological knowledge and our empathic nature, you’d be surprised how fun, interesting and warm people can be.
One thing INTJ’s (and i’m proud to say) are allergic to is the smalltalk people tend to do a lot, that’s something that’s pityfully there in any conversation (solved by pressing the “nod” button).
And yes, logic and love don’t go together well, but we are not machines and do not run solely on logic.
@dragulagu, I totally agree with you. But although I managed to achieve extremely rewarding relationships (for both parts, I believe) with friends and some family members, I’m still struggling to be that successful in “romantic” relationships. I’ve read they were INTJ Achilles’ heel and that’s true for me.
I don’t think, however, that it has something to do with coldness or robot mode, but definitely with the “analytical brain” Barbara was talking about. I often listen things like “You think too much”, “you’re over complicating things”, “Why do you have to analyze/understand everything?”. And I’m aware that I think too much… but, can’t help it! I’m sure it is tiresome for some people…
But, well, you’re always developing and improving, and I’m still in my late 20’s too, so I believe I’ll get there…
I often listen things like “You think too much”, “you’re over complicating things”, “Why do you have to analyze/understand everything?”.
Ha, I can relate so much to that!
But it can actually be something hilarious because after I got those same answers i started to “analyse” the people i talk to and see their reaction when my mind is going on a full spin, halting the conversation with a “i”m starting to sound confusing, aren’t I” and them reacting honestly to it.
That’s the fun thing of our mindset, our minds tend to jump into a rapid continuous observation of everything around. I would think it’s rather fascinating than a burden since it does give
There’s one exception though I found out and that’s my ENTP friend. When i was starting into a overdrive thought process on something and people were confused, somehow he translates perfectly what I’m saying to them.
Which on it’s own also gives hilarious moments of “what he means is…” and your dumbfound friends suddenly understanding with a sigh as if I had a personal translator.
Now that I make sense to myself….I’d like to go into this long spiel like everyone else but I really just don’t feel like relating to any of you honestly.
*chuckle* I think that calls for a standing ovation.
I really like what the two of you said here. It was helpful and encouraging. I guess if we had our personal relationships nailed; we’d be perfect. And who wants to live with perfection. (I’m smiling too) Thank you!
My pleasure
This idiot’s guide is awesome. I always felt like an alien until I took the MBTI in school and read about being an INTJ Mastermind. Now I feel like a happy alien that knows herself a little better.
My goodness, this thread had me cracking up; andt takes quite a bit to make me laugh (other than witty remarks and the occasional ‘it’s-so-stangely-spontaneous-that-it’s-hilarious’ kind of thing for me). I found out I was an INTJ and I’m still learning because I’m young, nearly 16, so quite young. I must say, high school is terrible.
The teachers are incompetent, the kids are shallow, and the food is lousy. I can’t small talk worth a damn which seems to be the epitome of high school conversation (A.K.A the only thing they’re minds are capable of); needless to say, I don’t exactly have many friends. I could make some if I actually sincerely tried, but I don’t see the need to. The extra commitment to constantly keep up a friendship is exhausting. That and I live in a gooberville town in Alabama so all anyone wants to talk about it football, hunting, and camouflage. I’m African American as well and I get confused looks whenever I actually do speak in my classes because I ‘don tak lik dis’ I’m not ghetto. It’s the narrow-minded idiots that think skin color decides your lexicon. I digress.
Anyway, similar to Juan, I was asked questions like this all the time. Here’s one for example:
If you’re stranded on a deserted island in the middle of nowhere and you can only bring three things with you, what would you bring?
My answer: a boat stocked with enough food and water to get me to civilization (preferrably with internet and/or phone access), a tarp that can double as a sleeping blanket, to prevent heat stroke or heat exhaustion during the day and hypothermia in the night, and a compass. There are definitely other things that I would bring but those would be the very basic needs. Anyone else have any other thoughts?
Sorry to rant for so long, it’s not everyday that I get to talk to other INTJs (even if it is semi-anonymous).
knife, fire making items, and a picture of the family
I would go with a personal heli with unlimited fuel , official papers for the ownership of the island and a 7 star all included hotel on it with unlimited supplies. I could start my own desert island franchise!
Whoo, finally someone my age!
I just found out yesterday that I’m an INTJ, and I’m mostly pleased with this discovery, but it does prove detrimental in high school.
Okay, so I just turned sixteen. Close enough.
Shall I do this chronologically?
I completely agree, I’m having so much fun reading all of these comments
I agree with you on all points. I was so happy when I lived in New York because I grew up with everyone so everyone knew who I was, understood me, to a certain extent, and the education was great. Now? I currently live in Florida, the worst state to go to school, I believe, and I know no one. Sure, I have friends. In the loosest form of the word.
I don’t have many true friends, the kind you can call up at three in the morning and have them run over to your house. Okay, so I don’t have anyone like that as of now. And, true, I could, if I wanted to. But I watch them, see their responses to certain situations and people, hear their biases and decided that they aren’t worth the effort. Sad, but true. Commitment? You’re absolutely right, it’s exhausting. No, I just can’t deal with it… I just don’t have time for them. I see them in school, five days a week—why can’t that be enough?
I know I can be judgmental, it’s like a core foundation for me, of people, but I really only judge people based of their mind. I know that sounds bad—So I hate people who aren’t as smart as me? No, it’s their decisions and actions that upset me. My potential best friend (and isn’t it just odd how I categorize people on what they could be if they meet my credentials… but I know I have to meet their’s also, which is why I reserve my opinion on people for a long time) isn’t, admittedly, as smart as me in academics, but I was able to tell almost immediately that she was people and street smart. While I have common sense and an impression that I’d do well on my own, she would flourish so quickly that you’d think she was years older than she actually is (not that age actually determines success, just that experience helps).
I’m white, and I actually was actually culture-shocked when I went to Virginia for a summer at my cousin’s house and realized, yes, some black people (does that insult you? I met this girl who had a tendency to flip out when the word ‘black’ was uttered, though she did nothing when people said ‘white.’ But, honestly, I think it’s stupid calling people ‘African American.’ Then I’d be ‘European American,’ and that’s simply redundant. I’d also be Polish American, German American, Scottish American, Irish American… you see? True, I’m not technically ‘white’ just like you are not technically ‘black’ but it simplifies it, don’t you think? I told a teacher that once. She thinks I’m insane) actually talked lik dis’. I honestly thought that they were some wannabe idiots, because I thought that’s was just a music and movie thing… I grew up a bit sheltered and in a town that, while only forty-five minutes away from the city, was too far from the city. I had also thought that drugs were a thing of the past, that since people knew about the dangers, like death, that it just wasn’t done anymore. Well, you can imagine the shock I had had in middle school when a girl told me not to come into the bathroom because all the stalls were filled up from girls who were smoking.
But yes, high school is full of the dreaded small talk. People don’t understand when I tell them I genuinely despise school. ‘But you do so well in your classes!’ So? I’d rather be home-schooled. As in, self-taught, not parent-taught… *shudder* I would sooner run away to… somewhere then put myself through that torture. I, too, digress.
I bet your ready to get out of there first chance, huh? I think that’s what universities were originally for, and I don’t care what excuses institutions give, I don’t believe them. But instead of students, it started with men who wanted to get away from their wives…
Now as for your question… Hmm. A deserted island? Why in the world am I there? How did I even get there? Well, fine. I would bring a white, air-conditioned truck, van, or RV (completely stocked, of course) to drive in and sleep, extra gas, water, and food pulled in a storage wagon (or whatever it’s called) attached to the truck, and definitely a computer with internet access.
It’s refreshing to read these comments. I knew I wasn’t alone, but I’ve yet to meet people like me in real life.
Im an INTJ. I’ve read every comment on here and I feel like Im home! I work in risk management. My favourite pastime is researching. I want to know about everythin. Because Im not so good at communicating , I believe having a wider knowledge base will help me relate to people better as I might understand them a little bit more if I know some of their interests. At the same time I want people to stay away from me unless I ask for their presence. People think Im rude, blunt and just a bitch. I just don’t like talking to people that much because they don’t actually have anything significant to say! I love discussing theories when people do actually know what they are talking about though. Oh and I am 23 and female.
Big fan of assessments of all types although I don’t think they are all valid of course. Has anyone tried the Strengths Deployment Inventory (SDI)? Great assessment for understanding yourself and others. Best part is the Portrait of Overdone Strengths (mine is Abrasive). It shows you how your strengths, when overdone, can be of detriment.
I’m an INTJ and I believe in God. lol, I just realized that sounded like one of those Alcoholics Anonymous meetings, except I’m admitting to being a theist instead of an alcoholic. Whatever, I’m not into organized religion, I haven’t been to church in I don’t know how long (mainly because it puts me to sleep). I do love Jesus, not ashamed of that, He made me love Him in spite of myself. I do struggle with my faith and perhaps even more so with Christians themselves, who seem to say one thing and do another. I’ve been over the debates with religion and science backwards and forwards and sideways. In the end I agree with what Jesus taught and the way to live by putting others needs before your own. If I’m wrong I won’t know it anyway and until that time I will strive to love, I believe that love is the greatest thing on earth if nothing else.
About a year ago I attended a 4 session debate with a friend between pro-creationist professors on one side and pro-evolutionist professors on the other side. And what I concluded was that neither side does and will understand the triviality of their discussions. Not that they didn’t make valid points on either side. Rather that they always ended up with throwing arguments at each other like children for what originally would’ve been a discussion session for darwinism and where it belonged in the current society. And this for professionals in this theoretical matter.
In the end, in my opinion, you should not be struggling with your religion if you took the choice to us it as the red wire in your life. Every person needs to follow their set of morals, whether it’s based on parental advice, religion, social, scientific or even your own as long as you stick to those morals.
Because what I’m rather seeing now with the disbelieve that is nowadays is that there are more people with a lack of morals due to not being able to handle the individualism everyone has now with “free religion”.
Individualism on morality is something we need to work to, but you need to be prepared for it and most of the people in this world…aren’t quite yet ready for it.
You do realize that there is no “pro-evolution” & that it’s a hard, falsifiable fact & has been observed in the wild, right?
Saying there’s some sort of contraversy is akin to still believing Earth is flat after the Copernican Revolution.
Sources on request.
^ Psychological manipulation detected. Nice Pascal’s Wage, a perfectly sound reason to build a worldview based on tautology.
Faith: firm belief in something for which there is no proof
Source: Merriam Webster
I kind of believe in God, nah I would rather construct and reconstruct my own concept of GOD so the crap won’t get in my way of messing with people =)
I need to be best friends with all of you. Stat.
‘Compleat’ is spelt ‘complete’.
I just found out, like several of you, that I’m INTJ. It’s nice to know that I’m not the only one who was born this way.
Anyway my relationships don’t seem to last probably due to the fact that I hold my partners up to my own high standards and they always seem fall short. I have tried to set my needs for order and perfection aside, and have found out that it just doesn’t make me happy to lower my standards.
Nothing’s ever in its home, the place is a freakin’ pigsty, the TV’s on 24/7 (NOT an exaggeration), I could go on… I’m seriously considering moving out just so I can have some peace of mind.
I too have relationship issues. I’m nearly 55 and have had four serious relationships in my life (Zero casual relationships), and obviously, none has lasted. While I do like being in a committed relationship, dating’s never been something I’ve enjoyed — too much small talk.
I think the perfect situation was when my current husband worked out of town and was only home on weekends. My need for order and tranquility was satisfied five days a week, and I was able to put my perfectionism aside for a day and a half each week. Too bad that didn’t last…
S**t hit the fan, when hubby had a horrible industrial accident and was forced to retire. He’s recovering nicely, thanks, but he’s home all the time now; and I’m a total mess. I work 55 to 60 hours a week and have neither the time nor the energy to play housemaid to him any longer.
Anyone have any advice to the INTJ lovelorn,?
Discovered your site after researching some INTP/INTJ comparisons.
When I tested in my teens I was unfailingly extreme on the INT with a low degree of P. Recently I started testing again in variety of moods… apparently I am now an INTJ, but these test results (and how much worth can you place on self-testing, anyway?) are so close that I may as well have the decision in my own hands; I’m sure that the very process of researching and identifying my traits, subconsciously picking the ones I would prefer to have and allowing myself to take pride in and actively enjoy said traits will force out my true colours.
Or whatever. If the system doesn’t conform to me, I’m not going to make myself conform to the system. But I will use it to attempt to understand myself better. Wait, what an INTJ thing to say! Hummm…
Either way I find the practicality of J wins out in my internal arguments. As much as I’d like to think I research and explore for the knowledge itself, if I’m honest with myself, my motivations are more complex… and also more selfish.
I also find the self-assured “fuck you” of INTJ very freeing; I’ve always felt and thought this way, but the onus to be polite often tunes it down. Thanks to the lobotomising meatgrinder which is modern society (HEADS DOWN, EYES FRONT, USE BLACK INK, PRINT YOUR NAME CLEARLY) I’m only beginning to discover myself. Or is that a cop-out? I guess over the past years my capacity for the bullshit of others has expired.
tl;dr:
I’m not 100% sure I’m an INTJ. Does it matter? I was beginning to feel a bit unhinged, so it’s nice to meet others with similar experiences.
(Feel free to inform me in a snarky fashion that I don’t belong here. I’m sure I’ll burst into tears and retreat to the INTP forums if you’re mean enough!)
you are an INTJ…sorry. go to the forum where the INTPs will hug you, and make you feel human for approximately 10 minutes. Have fun!!
Hah, nice try with that last sentence. As if you aren’t one of us
A true INTJ would consider a 2% occurrence in the population possesses equal probability of being a handicap as it does genius. Amazing how many misdiagnose themselves on purpose just to call themselves an INTJ. Hello? We are reading your stuff. Don’t you think we can tell who’s faking it. Wasn’t a question. If you are a real INTJ it will be something you can’t help and it will show up again and again. No matter what test you take or how many, the printout at the end will label you the same because you can’t hide who you are inside. Be what you are and stop trying to be what you’re not.
In the name of science I would like to see posts that do not bastardize the true INTJ type with that of gender. True, INTJ is 3 times more likely to be born male than female but it is no excuse to write these posts with male overtones and call it an ongoing study of the INTJ. I’m so tempted to edit your stuff and point out where you assume far too much.
What did one INTJ say to another who claimed to be the same? Prove it!
Wow, so someone who doesn’t get consistently massive percentiles is not a “true” INTJ? How arrogant and close-minded. It is the nature of a human being to have a spectrum of both internal and external identities for various social, emotional and intellectual situations. We fluctuate.
The MBTI is just a tool to help one understand both their own self and others around them. It’s not some static starsign or allotted fate. Besides, it just doesn’t make sense for every human being to fit EXACTLY into the 16 typings. Indeed, I think INTJs know pretty well how it feels to not fit in, so your “all or nothing” is grasping and petty. Why does it bother you so much, anyway? Do all these other people typing into the “2%” make you feel less special? I think you’re missing the point.
And in case you’re wondering, this post is only party fuelled by the fact I was one of the people posting a spectrum result. Mostly I just dislike your attitude. “Oooh, you didn’t score as highly/constantly as I did! You must be faking!”
I mean you say “be yourself”, but essentially you’re asserting that if someone’s typing is not concrete, they’re not being honest. I have some labelled boxes lying around if you need them so badly.
That could be fun. Shall we challenge each other to post our personal mantras/philosophies/idioms/etc.? Or perhaps you have another idea/method to approach your assertion?
Wow, that was a good laugh. I guess I’m as smart as I know I am. Loved it!
Found out that I’m an INTJ. The descriptions are all very true but it is somewhat sad to realize that my so-called individuality can be summarized by a psychological dictionary.
One thing I couldn’t find an answer to is why I tend to strongly dislike, or easily get bored of, people who talk about themselves when not prompted to do so. Is this really an INTJ trait?
Great forum…Other than (occasionally) the WSJ comments, so infrequent to find any intelligence among commentors.
I tested as an INTJ in 1995 and again in 2011. Certainly, it’s reassuring to find like-minded others. As an INTJ female, I’ve been ‘at home’ career-wise among engineers and other builders. I’m the program manager among them.
Btw, I simply thought ‘Compleat’ was an attempt to avoid copyright infringement!
If it helps, advice on successful INTJ relationships (I’m 48 and had much the same start as many of the 20-somethings above) is to find ways to value other styles. My approach is to point out all the things that I personally would not want to do to keep society or projects or whatever moving along and be thankful that the appropriate personalities are out there to address nearly everything. Keep exploring what brings you satisfaction and set your priorities accordingly.
This may/may not have been discussed on this long as life comment chain, but has a study been done to document the most likely and least likely astrological signs that best indicate an individual’s personality type? I am personally an Aquarius and have found that many Aquarian traits are very INTJ-like. Feel free to email me directly at hello [at] thesmileyeffect [dot] com.
I’m INTJ, and retired after 32 yrs. as a psychiatric RN. I enjoyed trying to figure out what made patients tick, and even grew fond of a few. A colleague once told me, “Walt, you pretend to care better than anybody I know”. I, of course, took it as a complement, which was not the way he meant it.
I’m now involved somewhat with an ISFJ, and it’s interesting. Anyone else been there, have some advice or experiences to share?. Thanks
I just discovered that I’m an INTJ, and “Mastermind”, and I’ve read most of the posts here…very interesting stuff. I’ve been comparing myself.
…also feel I should note that I’m a Taurus, and diagnosed schizophrenic/schizoaffective, and it’s interesting to be part of two categories of rare (or hard to understand) personalities (schizophrenic and INTJ).
I’m not sure where all of my traits come together, because I am everything INTJ, but not usually the elitist type, but, yes, sometimes I really just want to say “You ‘x’ people are stupid, and if you would just disappear, some work could get done around here!”
I have issues with reality, from time to time, and it’s funny how schizo and INTJ can work together. Say, if I hear a voice (and yes, occasionally I have auditory hallucinations) I may consider I’m just hallucinating, OR the voice is caused by some malfunctioning electrical impulse in my brain, OR the voice is coming from outside my head and I just need to find the source…etc.
Sleeping can be tough, because I don’t want to sleep, unless I’ve completed a train of thought. If it didn’t make me feel so tired, I probably would barely sleep at all. I could get so much more done.
Also, I’m artistic/creative. So…imaginative, and I with the creativity, INTJ, schizo, and a dash of agoraphobia, I find it really difficult to fit in with society. Currently, I’m almost silent in public, because I don’t trust how people would react to me, but I’m slowly training myself to be more myself at all times.
I don’t like confrontation, but I tend to find myself disagreeing with almost everyone. I’m actually very spontaneous, but within sensible bounds. I may suddenly feel the urge to run on all fours, which makes no sense, but if I don’t see any logical reason why I shouldn’t do it, I just go with it. …and it’s really hard for me to resist doing these things in public. I get this burning/itching sensation, like I will explode, if I don’t run on all fours.
I’m hoping that one day I will be able to run with it (heh, heh) in public. I feel like I’m too concerned with societal rules, and they’re killing me.
Yes, I did laugh
Just found out that I still am an INTJ ( I did the test years and years ago). I am one of the few wemen INTJ’s. I do have a genius IQ ( over 155) and have numerous graduate degrees. I am never satisfied with my career and have changed it over 6 times:). No one “gets” me. I love this list, so true, all of it! Loved the list of pet peeves. I hate sales people and just want to buy what I want and leave. At the grocery store I always do the self checkout and get mad when someone what to help me. Did I ask for your help? Do I look like I need help? Anyway – I have my dog and he accepts me for all my quirks, because I haven’t found anyone else who will 
I came across this site trying to find out why I can’t get into INTJ forum. Do you think other INTJ’s would deliberately screw with their fellow MBTI type and reject their registration 5 times in a row even if it’s filled out correctly? Or maybe a simple glitch in the registration program? Oh and by the way, I guess I’ll keep checking out this site. Carry on and all that stuff…
o hay I’m INTJ too lol. just saying hello.
@Red It annoys me too, mainly because no one fucking asked them to, LOL. But probably also because them talking about themselves = they think they have something to say = they think what they have to say is important —> but really they’re just saying the same old bs everyone else says. Unless you tell me a story about you fucking riding a cow into outer space or something ridiculous like that, or you used to have 16 arms but you lost them in a fight with 17 samurai, then no matter what you say, is probably not that interesting. And it’s kind of annoying having to listen to someone talk about things that are so dull……… i.e. “normal” lol. Jmo though, there could be another reason but that would be mine.
I have one question, is it hard for other INTJ’s to express themselves as well as retain information. I just always get this feeling that the information lingers in your mind, you are trying to get at it but can’t.
Hello INTJ’s.
How refreshing to read that others think similar to myself. I used to feel terrible when someone would incessantly yap and that familiar irritation of wanting to do anything to shut them up would surface within me. Seriously, listening to someone compulsively talk about nothing of importance and seeing my own intolerance had me doubting myself terribly. Wasn’t until I requested some testing did I find out that these traits were a gift and by working with them rather than against them would improve my quality of life immensely. So, that said, once I changed course and achieved the balance of alone time, research (my sons tell me I am a collector of “topics of interests”….bang on if you ask me.), minimal socialization (obligatory visits & necessary events) & healthy eating (I am a serious health geek and have a library on various health subjects.) my happiness meter went up significantly. Those around me still consider me an odd duck and some do find me too blunt, however I prefer to think I’m just cutting through all the layers of a topic to get to the nitty gritty. All the fluff is simply not necessary for me.
Does anyone have any websites or books to suggest on INTJ personalities?
Happy researching, fellow INTJ’s.
I find this INTJ blog and website to be comical, somewhat interesting, and another facet of information to glean from all at the same time. A good 20 years ago I was tested and rated a strong INTJ. I Just went through 5 different associated/similar test to see what variations might come about. One INTP, all the others…INTJ, which of course amused me so much that I continued on to explore further.
After reading the running list of postings, I started to think about my observations of my Shiba Inu dog. He is my second one in 15 years, and I can tell you from years of observations, and interactions (that is when they deemed it desirable) Shiba’s are the INTJ’s of the Animal World. Overall they tend to be reclusive and aloof, but highly intelligent and extremely sensitive. They only interact with you when they decide that it is necessary or desirable from their perspective. They can appear from nowhere in front of you, or from the side almost unseen, intently taking you in, half out of the room, half in as if “I am here, maybe…maybe not”. If you try to pet them at this time, they are usually indignant that you miss read them or tried to project your interpretation of what you thought they were doing. They also can be extremely playful and attentive out of the blue. Just get used to the fact that it can end as quickly as it started, and their mind and attention is elsewhere in a blink of an eye as if the previous playfulness hadn’t even happened.
They spend a great deal of time by themselves out of sight. They choose a room in the house that is “their” room that they retreat to. Only coming out now and then to abstractly view the terrain in a seemingly disinterested casual way. They have no interest in coming when you call them from their retreat regardless of how often you entreat them to show themselves. My first Shiba, Sebastian, would spend every morning in the same exact spot outside looking up into the trees for a half hour to 40 minutes, not moving at all, totally unaware, couldn’t be bothered by other animals around him or anything else, looking to be deep in thought or introspection, oblivious of where he was or time itself. My other Shiba, Tomma, goes into trances standing up with head slightly lowered, standing in the exact same spot for 20 minutes or more. Then, all at once looks up and comes back to the present moment.
They show quick affection when you come home, but just as quickly disappear when they realized they have to moderate the affection they show you, less you get the wrong idea of what to expect from them. At the same time they are extremely sensitive and have a strong attachment to you but take great efforts to hide their feelings and dependence on you. I could go on and on, but the fact is i have concluded that they are the perfect dog for an INTJ because they operate in a similar universe, don’t have to be constantly reassured that you love them and their interaction with other dogs is so much like an INTJ that it is comical to watch them interact/not interact, in the dog world. The final thought is to look at the dog world of personalities in total to see if the other personality types exist in the rest of the dog breeds. OK, well, that was just one of my tangents of thoughts that took off after reading this blog.
Omg I love this place lolol
I am of course an intj and always refer to the Myers Briggs test lol. It’s just so nice that even though I’m only14, I have a place where I’m not surrounded by complete idiots 
Ok…I am seriously over thinking my post already…
I will not worry too much if I make grammatical mistakes…as I already know what I don’t know and I absolutely over think everything already. I am prepared for the Judging…that just comes with the territory. My mother was narcissistic so I am used to being looked down upon no matter how I express myself. Ok…ok…I will get to the point already.
Let’s not over generalize what is or isn’t the makeup of an INTJ. It is a broad spectrum and not to be pinned down. But here I go anyway…I’ll just describe myself
ONE:
I am a loner but I don’t really want to be. Making and keeping LONG term friendships where they don’t betray, lie or make illogical arguments…that is my dream. Really want those that aren’t needy.
TWO:
I always watch from the outside until I really see an issue that I would love to correct. Until I have all the facts…I just can’t/wont’ move on a strong statement. I research to the degree of almost standing still…You should see my bookmarks.
THREE:
If you are an authority on something…I might listen if it makes sense. I can’t read right through you if you are full of it and just looking for attention.
Now, if needed, please fire at will.
Nice to see a few other INTJ women on here. I have yet to meet one in real life. As for career: social scientist (I study people as if they were animals or bits of bacteria in a laboratory) working as a government regulator (trying to get people to follow the rules). Suits me fine once I realized that people will not follow the rules but my job is to tell them to do it anyway.
I totally understand your point with MATHS (Indian, have the brit edge), I really really sucked at Maths for ages, and felt that I would never understand the head or toe of it. Yet, today as an Investment Banker I totally crunch figures on the fly. I tell my friends put a $ sign before a number and it makes sense.
I believe it’s more on realizing the importance of the subject, I realized that the squares and cubes of X will hold low utility for me. Again, highlighting the fact that we know our own limitations, and though I was a fairly “Well Known” guy in school, never really got along with people.
For a large part of my life I would’ve described myself as an extrovert, I get along with people (have a high level of tolerance and highly developed auto pilot mode now I realize
) and always offered solutions to the problems. But recently I started to realize that my social life and relationships were limited and strained at most times, thereby, drawing me into concluding that extroversion was not something that I really practiced.
I found out that I was an INTJ very recently, when after my 14 year old dog died and I felt little remorse, I instinctively used the INTJ way of finding answers, RESEARCH and took the MBIT and found out that I am an INTJ with more than 50% on all parameters and 100% on intuition, I feel now at ease to know that I am not as “HEARTLESS” as people imply that I am.
As for the question of Moral obligation I would agree with @Mikethe2nd, at the age of 10 he had deduced and said what we would be a little ashamed of admitting now, that the inefficient and slow people of the world should be at best, left alone to be at the bottom where they can not hurt the efficiency of the system. We are all born equals (barring birth defects) and take our own course of action and we should have the courage to live by our own choices. If you find yourself drawing the short end of the stick, it’s largely your fault, having played a game of chance not considering the consequences and results of the actions.
PS: Even though we don’t like long posts and don’t like many words, I have realized that we have the ability to speak endlessly, and jump from thought to thought without any overtly coherent link as can be seen from my post and that of my fellow INTJS.
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